Technical Forums» Technical / Performance» Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune?
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since:  Posts:  |
Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Fri 11 Dec 2009 01:39:54 PM |
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Hi guys,
I had a problem with my standard tb. So I upgraded to a ga15 tb. All the problems have perished but now it feels to have some flat spots in acceleration. Would a tune with a digital fuel adjuster cure this problem? Or is the tb shot? I read something about tuning before, can't find it though cheers, Adam. |
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sikK11 » CMF Member Darwin Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Fri 11 Dec 2009 03:18:12 PM |
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from what i have seen with the GA15 TB and inkectors you do develop some pretty bad flat spots so i was told. I still have not done this mod to my micra as i am worried about spending close to 400 for all the parts just to find it puts a flat spot in the mix. So i will be watching this space carefully and seeing what come of this problem and how its fixed
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Fri 11 Dec 2009 03:49:59 PM |
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Well I managed to find a jaycar DFA plus hand controller for $50 so i'll give that a shot and see how it goes.
I still have standard injectors, car seems to run fine with them, but with the standard tb it used to run very rich, mmm. |
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fred » CMF Member Murwillumbah Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sat 12 Dec 2009 12:13:10 AM |
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I use the jaycar dfa with ga15 and primera injectors and its pretty good.... easy to setup and tune (with air/fuel ratio meter and the hand controller). I can write my numbers down to give youse a rough guide, if it'll help. You can also do tuning on the fly if you want.
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sat 12 Dec 2009 11:31:42 AM |
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did it fix your flat spots fred?
Numbers would be good, would save the hassle of putting on the dyno (though i'm curious how much power my bucket would make lol) |
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fred » CMF Member Murwillumbah Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sat 12 Dec 2009 01:46:16 PM |
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yep
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Tue 15 Dec 2009 04:59:10 PM |
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ok, just recieved it today. Now to figure out which wire the DFA needs to run off ...
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fred » CMF Member Murwillumbah Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Tue 15 Dec 2009 09:30:22 PM |
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look at the the article.....http://www.micra.com.au/technical-articles/e-manage-wiring-diagram.php
just need to cut the Mass airflow line and join that wire from the engine to go into the DFA input and the DFA output goes back to the ECU input. start the car: the idle will be off so i adjusted the VR2 so that idle comes back to normal.... vr2 is the multi turn pot just below the input output terminal block on the DFA circuit board. I then wired up the O2 sensor with a splade connector so that I can run the o2 sensor out of loop but the a/f ratio meter is still connected (if that makes sense) and then u can begin to drive it around and tune it (make sure you have one person driving and the over adjusting the fuel levels...or go and get it dynoed... after tuning clip the computer line back into the ecu and you're done. hope that helps! |
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Tue 15 Dec 2009 10:31:26 PM |
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ok, just to make sure, i look for the Silver/green wire shown as the "mass air flow" on the diagram, cut it in the middle, and connect the output of the DFA onto the other half of the cut wire?
Did you splice the power and ground from the ecu to use on the DFA? I'm guessing the ECU is under the carpet on the passenger side? |
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fred » CMF Member Murwillumbah Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Wed 16 Dec 2009 07:36:41 AM |
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my wire was solid green from memory.... all of the above is right (ecu on the firewall on the floor centre of car) I'll double check the wire colour. yeah, I spliced into the ecu power. the dfa can be mounted with foam under the 'tissue box holder' beneath the centre console, so its completely out of sight, I also keep the hand controller connected and mounted in the glove box just in case.
I'm nearly finished the Jaycar programmable ignition modules so I might make a thread about that later..... |
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frank2 » CMF Member birmingham United Kingdom Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Wed 16 Dec 2009 08:34:25 AM |
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fred WROTE: I'm nearly finished the Jaycar programmable ignition modules so I might make a thread about that later....." you,re the man fred ;) i think this is the stock A/F/R,s with the usual mods (upper red line) quite lean from 4k onwards |
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Wed 16 Dec 2009 06:24:10 PM |
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alrighty, installed it and everythings running fine!
i ended up moving the module underneath the factory ECU and hand controller is now located in that little pouch underneath the steering coloum. Fred, could i ask one more thing of you? could i pinch your tuning setup for the time being? I'm running standard injectors, so if anything i'll need to lean out your tune for the time being. thanks for the help. Frank, what mods did you have to make that power? it would be nice to Crack 100hp lol. |
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frank2 » CMF Member birmingham United Kingdom Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Wed 16 Dec 2009 07:11:54 PM |
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RoadsterGarage WROTE: Frank, what mods did you have to make that power? it would be nice to Crack 100hp lol. " its polly,s printout adam, page 1 on here (warning, looots of pics on page 1) http://www.micra.org.uk/showthread.php?t=35251&page=2 i believe the lower line is after ED (fusion) re-mapped his stock ecu frank |
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Wed 16 Dec 2009 07:40:39 PM |
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mmm, Nistune ECU, Janspeed exhaust, Jun flywheel and CAI
I think i'd put out something similar, i have Hurricane headers, custom exhaust, enlarged intake GA15DE throttle body, TB coolant bypass, heavy duty clutch and the DFA. |
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sikK11 » CMF Member Darwin Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Wed 16 Dec 2009 10:33:13 PM |
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I got Jun Flywheel hurricane extractors and CAI and i made 87bhp so if you can tune the fuel and fine tune the timing as the Dizzy can be moved. So you should see something a little better then me
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fred » CMF Member Murwillumbah Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Thu 17 Dec 2009 08:48:00 AM |
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I just noticed my tune is a little lean in the lower rpm so I'll fix that today and post the numbers... just set on 'view' and press in the numbers (white arrow keys to change load points and black arrow keys to change fuel value)
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Thu 17 Dec 2009 09:45:35 AM |
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Sweet, your a legend Fred!
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sikK11 » CMF Member Darwin Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Thu 17 Dec 2009 05:20:48 PM |
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TB coolant bypass.
FRED can you link me a page on this please. I wanna see about doing it. Are there any benefits to doing this on a stock TB |
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Mickb » CMF Member Perth Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Thu 17 Dec 2009 05:46:09 PM |
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sikK11 WROTE: "TB coolant bypass. FRED can you link me a page on this please. I wanna see about doing it. Are there any benefits to doing this on a stock TB" The coolant is run through it to help with cold starts (i thought) but when your coolant is hot, all it does it make your tb hot, thus heating your intake air etc |
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Thu 17 Dec 2009 06:12:18 PM |
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reason why i did the TB bypass is because i wasn't bothered trying to get the lines onto the bigger fitting on the GA15DE throttle body.
Its easier taking off the throttle bodies too now, as i dont need to worry about coolant spilling and the like. Yes, the coolant that runs to the TB is to warm it up quicker, that is all. Its easy to do, take the coolant hoses off the throttle body, find a hose or pipe that is similar to what is on the throttle body, clamp it all together and your done. |
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Thu 17 Dec 2009 07:08:34 PM |
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Oh yeah, Fred, with your tune, would it work well with mine? as i am using standard injectors still.
When you get the print out ready, i'll richen it a little to be safe. |
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sikK11 » CMF Member Darwin Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Thu 17 Dec 2009 07:39:29 PM |
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Hmmmm I live in darwin and never have any issues with Cold starts anyway. Will do this on the weekend i think
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Thu 17 Dec 2009 08:16:06 PM |
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Yeah, should be all good dude, you may need to raise/lower idle a little though, its not hard there is a little allen key screw on the throttle body.
Adjust it until your happy with where it is idleing. MMM, so keen to play with this DFA! |
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frank2 » CMF Member birmingham United Kingdom Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Thu 17 Dec 2009 08:28:58 PM |
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i had to dismatle the coldstart fast idle on mine, because that bypass pipe works the waxstat, which holds the throttle open slightly via the quadrant
frank |
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1300cc » CMF Member melbourne Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Fri 18 Dec 2009 01:32:00 AM |
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frank
would the jaycar dfa worth installing on stock Tb? only mods probably will be full exhaust system and airfilter? |
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frank2 » CMF Member birmingham United Kingdom Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Fri 18 Dec 2009 04:27:53 AM |
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1300cc WROTE: "frank would the jaycar dfa worth installing on stock Tb? only mods probably will be full exhaust system and airfilter?" i dont know mate, i,ve seen a couple of posts saying that the midrange needs about 30% enrichment with similar specs to yours :) frank |
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Fri 18 Dec 2009 11:19:35 AM |
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Any chance of that print out Fred?
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fred » CMF Member Murwillumbah Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sat 19 Dec 2009 02:15:09 PM |
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I had never been happy with the tune since I've taken the turbo off,so I've taken the numbers, put them in a spread sheet smoothed the curve, put the numbers back into the DFA, went for a tune, wrote the numbers down, and now If just tried to smooth the curves again. Not tested it yet but should be a fairly good starting point, might need a little more around the 50-60 points depending on your mechanical variation but there is plenty as the revs rise.
"Jaycar DFA Tuning in K11 Micra with GA15 hrottle body and Primera Injectors, Pod Filter, Standard exhaust header, 2"" sport exhaust." POS Amount POS Amount POS Amount POS Amount 1 0 33 -6 65 3 97 11 2 0 34 -5 66 3 98 10 3 0 35 -5 67 3 99 10 4 0 36 -5 68 4 100 9 5 0 37 -6 69 6 101 10 6 0 38 -7 70 6 102 10 7 0 39 -7 71 7 103 11 8 0 40 -6 72 8 104 10 9 0 41 -5 73 8 105 9 10 0 42 -4 74 8 106 9 11 0 43 -4 75 9 107 10 12 0 44 -4 76 9 108 10 13 0 45 -3 77 10 109 10 14 0 46 -3 78 10 110 11 15 0 47 -2 79 11 111 11 16 0 48 -2 80 11 112 11 17 0 49 -2 81 11 113 11 18 0 50 -1 82 12 114 12 19 -10 51 -1 83 12 115 12 20 -10 52 -1 84 11 116 12 21 -10 53 0 85 11 117 12 22 -10 54 1 86 12 118 14 23 -10 55 1 87 13 119 16 24 -10 56 2 88 13 120 14 25 -10 57 3 89 12 121 12 26 -10 58 3 90 11 122 12 27 -10 59 4 91 10 123 12 28 -10 60 4 92 10 124 12 29 -10 61 4 93 10 125 12 30 -9 62 3 94 10 126 12 31 -9 63 3 95 11 127 12 32 -9 64 3 96 12 128 12 |
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fred » CMF Member Murwillumbah Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sat 19 Dec 2009 02:15:48 PM |
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damn that didn't space out so well...try again..hang on
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fred » CMF Member Murwillumbah Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sat 19 Dec 2009 02:23:13 PM |
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editing it does seem to work and I would be there forever, so here is it is in single colomn......
Load Point Load Variation 1 0 2 0 3 0 4 0 5 0 6 0 7 0 8 0 9 0 10 0 11 0 12 0 13 0 14 0 15 0 16 0 17 0 18 0 19 -10 20 -10 21 -10 22 -10 23 -10 24 -10 25 -10 26 -10 27 -10 28 -10 29 -10 30 -9 31 -9 32 -9 33 -6 34 -5 35 -5 36 -5 37 -6 38 -7 39 -7 40 -6 41 -5 42 -4 43 -4 44 -4 45 -3 46 -3 47 -2 48 -2 49 -2 50 -1 51 -1 52 -1 53 0 54 1 55 1 56 2 57 3 58 3 59 4 60 4 61 4 62 3 63 3 64 3 65 3 66 3 67 3 68 4 69 6 70 6 71 7 72 8 73 8 74 8 75 9 76 9 77 10 78 10 79 11 80 11 81 11 82 12 83 12 84 11 85 11 86 12 87 13 88 13 89 12 90 11 91 10 92 10 93 10 94 10 95 11 96 12 97 11 98 10 99 10 100 9 101 10 102 10 103 11 104 10 105 9 106 9 107 10 108 10 109 10 110 11 111 11 112 11 113 11 114 12 115 12 116 12 117 12 118 14 119 16 120 14 121 12 122 12 123 12 124 12 125 12 126 12 127 12 128 12 notice idle doesn't happen until load point 26-30, You may have to fiddle with the numbers low and between 50-65 which is my cruise numbers which are a little leaner. I will go for another tune run just to get it a bit finer. |
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sat 19 Dec 2009 08:15:26 PM |
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Fred, if your ever in sydney, let me know mate, I will buy you a beer for all your trouble :)
your tune works a charm, I still have a slight flat spot inbetween 4-5000rpm and 65-7000rpm. I presume I need to add some more voltage. Wow what a difference though, the car pulls ALOT harder then ever before. |
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fred » CMF Member Murwillumbah Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sat 19 Dec 2009 09:33:57 PM |
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cool, yeah just take a note what load points those flat spots are and go to VIEW on the hand controller and add +2 or +4 to the values at those points, should do it. You thought it was gunna be hard right?
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1300cc » CMF Member melbourne Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sun 20 Dec 2009 07:37:11 AM |
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sorry this could be a different topic, but wtill related to ga15ce tb, whats the fuel consumption once tuned,,,,how many litres/km?, would it be more thirsty?
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fred » CMF Member Murwillumbah Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sun 20 Dec 2009 11:26:43 AM |
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same...really.. except obviously when your driving aggressively....
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sikK11 » CMF Member Darwin Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sun 20 Dec 2009 09:33:57 PM |
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hey mate how much was the JCAR thing.....
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RoadsterGarage » CMF Member sydney Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Sun 20 Dec 2009 09:59:46 PM |
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i scored the module, hand controller and cord for $50.
some info about pricing and all can be found here http://s1.zetaboards.com/RoadsterGarage/topic/2589627/1/#new |
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fred » CMF Member Murwillumbah Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Mon 21 Dec 2009 09:15:38 AM |
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I made mine.... $79 for DFA + $50 for hand controller + $20 for cable..... check out www.autospeed.com ....they have pre-built ones. so roadster got a gooooood deal!
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1300cc » CMF Member melbourne Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Mon 21 Dec 2009 12:45:55 PM |
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it will cost you $260 assembled and tested at autospeed.com, if you dont know how to solder and assemble it, i suggest just buy the emanage
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1300cc » CMF Member melbourne Australia Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Mon 21 Dec 2009 08:08:26 PM |
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moderator, website is being attack again...
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asdame » CMF Member United Kingdom Member since: Posts: |
Re: Ga15 throttle ... Do I need a tune? |
Tue 22 Dec 2009 02:23:07 AM |
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frank2 WROTE: " RoadsterGarage WROTE: Frank, what mods did you have to make that power? it would be nice to Crack 100hp lol. " its polly,s printout adam, page 1 on here (warning, looots of pics on page 1) http://www.micra.org.uk/showthread.php?t=35251&;page=2 i believe the lower line is after ED (fusion) re-mapped his stock ecu frank" correct. bear in mind my pollymobile has PAS so it'll sap some power. could potentially goto 100bhp if i remove PAS. pollyp |
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